1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,460 And your age is? 2 00:00:03,460 --> 00:00:04,460 24. 3 00:00:04,460 --> 00:00:05,460 24. 4 00:00:05,460 --> 00:00:11,300 And any special training that you might have, you weren't in a military service, right? 5 00:00:11,300 --> 00:00:12,300 Right. 6 00:00:12,300 --> 00:00:14,300 Tell us what part of the service? 7 00:00:14,300 --> 00:00:15,300 Artillery. 8 00:00:15,300 --> 00:00:16,300 First Calvary Division. 9 00:00:16,300 --> 00:00:18,300 And you served overseas? 10 00:00:18,300 --> 00:00:19,300 Right. 11 00:00:19,300 --> 00:00:20,300 Where at? 12 00:00:20,300 --> 00:00:22,820 Vietnam, Okinawa and Korea. 13 00:00:22,820 --> 00:00:25,100 And you say your special training was artillery? 14 00:00:25,100 --> 00:00:26,100 Right. 15 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:31,600 Your day of observation was, was that the, you remember the evening, whether Monday, 16 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:32,600 Tuesday, Wednesday or Wednesday? 17 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:33,600 Saturday. 18 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:34,600 Saturday. 19 00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:35,600 And that would be May 12th. 20 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:36,600 All right. 21 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:38,600 And just about what time would it be? 22 00:00:38,600 --> 00:00:39,600 About 9.20. 23 00:00:39,600 --> 00:00:40,600 9.20. 24 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:42,600 And that seems to be the center time. 25 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:43,600 And where were you at? 26 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:46,600 And just go on and tell us a story from there. 27 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:49,600 Oh, it's coming back from camp. 28 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:52,600 I kept noticing the light. 29 00:00:52,600 --> 00:01:01,100 So when I stopped to see what was going on because it wasn't on the outlights around, 30 00:01:01,100 --> 00:01:08,700 I looked up our lumen shield in this light, which is over here in the front of the car, 31 00:01:08,700 --> 00:01:15,100 that flash from red to blue and blue to white and so forth. 32 00:01:15,100 --> 00:01:16,100 Three colors? 33 00:01:16,100 --> 00:01:18,100 Yeah, just three colors. 34 00:01:18,100 --> 00:01:21,100 There's lights were still going. 35 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:28,600 I couldn't see no exit of this guy in silver, clad in silver. 36 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:33,600 And it descended from under the lights to the pavement. 37 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:36,600 You actually saw him leave the area of the lights? 38 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:38,600 Underneath the lights. 39 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:42,600 I didn't see like, you know, a door or anything like that. 40 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:45,600 I mean, how close to the lights was he when you first saw him? 41 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,600 Ten feet from under the lights. 42 00:01:49,100 --> 00:01:52,100 And the lights were about a hundred feet. 43 00:01:52,100 --> 00:02:02,100 You know, above the pavement and this guy in silver, you know, clad all in silver or colored silver, whatever, 44 00:02:02,100 --> 00:02:08,100 descended from under the lights to the pavement directly in front of my car. 45 00:02:08,100 --> 00:02:10,100 You were already stopped? 46 00:02:10,100 --> 00:02:12,100 Yes, I had stopped. 47 00:02:12,100 --> 00:02:14,100 Why had you stopped? 48 00:02:14,100 --> 00:02:18,100 I stopped to investigate why the lights, you know, on and on. 49 00:02:18,100 --> 00:02:21,100 And this is why I stopped when I stopped the lights. 50 00:02:21,100 --> 00:02:28,600 Stopped, you know, how long was it from the time that you actually saw the lights to begin with the time that you actually stopped? 51 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:31,600 How many miles that you've driven or how long has it been? 52 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:35,600 Nye was about 20 seconds. 53 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:37,600 No, you don't understand this again. 54 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:39,100 You saw the lights. OK. 55 00:02:39,100 --> 00:02:41,600 It likes appear to be strange to you in some way. 56 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:47,600 But how long was it from the time that you first saw the lights to the time that you actually came to a stop in the middle? 57 00:02:48,100 --> 00:02:51,100 About a quarter mile. 58 00:02:51,100 --> 00:02:53,100 About a quarter mile. 59 00:02:53,100 --> 00:02:57,100 And what was it that caused you to stop? 60 00:02:57,100 --> 00:02:59,100 Did you think you saw a couple of lights in the sky? 61 00:02:59,100 --> 00:03:09,100 No. The way that the colors, you know, that the way it reflected in the flash, really the flash of the light, the way it was blinking, you know. 62 00:03:09,100 --> 00:03:11,100 You stopped to get a better look? 63 00:03:11,100 --> 00:03:13,100 Yeah, I stopped to see what was going on because... 64 00:03:13,100 --> 00:03:14,100 You didn't get out of the car? 65 00:03:14,100 --> 00:03:15,100 No. 66 00:03:15,100 --> 00:03:16,100 Didn't leave the car. 67 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:20,600 Were the lights then stopped in stationary position or were they moving about? 68 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:22,600 When I stopped, they stopped. 69 00:03:22,600 --> 00:03:24,600 Were they moving before that time? 70 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:32,600 No. Like, when I first seen it, it was the flash, you know, that made me curious what was going on. 71 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:36,600 OK, when I stopped, it was still flashing. 72 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:40,600 And then the flash, the light moved, came forward. 73 00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:43,600 And I could see it by looking up to the windshield. 74 00:03:44,100 --> 00:03:48,100 It was up at an angle, I'd say, 90 degree angle. 75 00:03:48,100 --> 00:03:50,100 And this is when I noticed the lights. 76 00:03:50,100 --> 00:03:56,100 They were just blinking, you know, in the shape of a football. 77 00:03:56,100 --> 00:03:59,100 The lights in the shape of, you know, you know, all I could see was lights. 78 00:03:59,100 --> 00:04:01,100 It was like in the shape of a football. 79 00:04:01,100 --> 00:04:13,100 And then this thing in silver, a little man, or whatever you want to call it, descended from underneath the lights. 80 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:15,600 Down to the pavement. 81 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:22,600 When it hit the pavement, it was looking off to the right. 82 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:25,600 And then it turned its head. 83 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:28,600 And its head only, it's the only thing that I see move. 84 00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:32,600 And it looked right into the windshield at me. 85 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:36,600 And this lasted for a good half a minute. 86 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:41,600 And then, and upward descent, like a helium balloon. 87 00:04:42,100 --> 00:04:46,100 And what it went up, the changes positioned in its head? 88 00:04:46,100 --> 00:04:48,100 No, it went straight back up. 89 00:04:49,100 --> 00:04:52,100 What was the appearance of this creature? 90 00:04:53,100 --> 00:04:57,100 It appeared to be something automatic, something machine-like, or it appeared to be something like... 91 00:04:57,100 --> 00:05:00,100 Human, to me, you know, it was alive. 92 00:05:00,100 --> 00:05:04,100 Or was it just an object made out of something to look like a human? 93 00:05:04,100 --> 00:05:06,100 Oh, I couldn't say. 94 00:05:06,100 --> 00:05:09,100 It looked more human than it looked. 95 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:13,600 Like something made out of automation. 96 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:15,600 You know, giving something a push and a blow. 97 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:16,600 Yeah. 98 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:19,600 You thought the creature did turn and look at you? 99 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:20,600 Yeah. 100 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:24,600 What features did you see as you looked directly at him? 101 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:30,600 Oh, I had a head and a body all shaped like a human. 102 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:38,600 Like a, you know what you might say, a grown man, small, no ears. 103 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:42,600 No hair, it was just all like in soap. 104 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:48,600 Like, I couldn't tell what it was, flesh or a suit or what. 105 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:50,600 What do you mean, this complexion, the silver also? 106 00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:53,600 Yeah, the face, the whole thing was also... 107 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:54,600 Head and nose? 108 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:55,600 Yes, it had a nose. 109 00:05:55,600 --> 00:05:56,600 Eyes? 110 00:05:56,600 --> 00:05:57,600 Eyes. 111 00:05:57,600 --> 00:05:58,600 And a mouth. 112 00:05:58,600 --> 00:05:59,600 Normal? 113 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:00,600 Yeah, like a... 114 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:05,600 Did it appear that you might have noticed any ethnic features? 115 00:06:06,100 --> 00:06:10,100 One that had high cheekbones, face was kind of... 116 00:06:10,100 --> 00:06:15,100 The jaws were like kind of pushed in, you know, on a narrow chin. 117 00:06:15,100 --> 00:06:17,100 Pushed in with a narrow chin? 118 00:06:17,100 --> 00:06:18,100 Yeah. 119 00:06:18,100 --> 00:06:19,100 What about the lips? 120 00:06:19,100 --> 00:06:22,100 Were they just lips or were they really lips? 121 00:06:22,100 --> 00:06:24,100 They were lips, you know. 122 00:06:24,100 --> 00:06:28,100 They had the fuller, very narrow or what? 123 00:06:28,100 --> 00:06:30,100 Narrow and small. 124 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:35,600 Would it have an elongation or would it have a round type of mouth, elongation? 125 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:36,600 No. 126 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:37,600 What about the nose? 127 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,600 Was it a ridgid or was it flat or what? 128 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:43,600 You might say Dutch nose, you know. 129 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:44,600 Dutch? 130 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:45,600 Yeah. 131 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:48,600 It's like more like a point. 132 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:51,600 You say Dutch, you mean a German? 133 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:52,600 German type of nose? 134 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:54,600 You mean you say Dutch? 135 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:56,600 Yeah, you might say that. 136 00:06:57,100 --> 00:07:00,100 You mean like some of these Nazis that you see on television? 137 00:07:00,100 --> 00:07:02,100 No. 138 00:07:04,100 --> 00:07:06,100 It was just a bike up. 139 00:07:06,100 --> 00:07:08,100 You see, I don't even know what a Dutch nose is. 140 00:07:08,100 --> 00:07:12,100 It's a pointed, you know, more like a pointed nose. 141 00:07:12,100 --> 00:07:14,100 What about shoulders? 142 00:07:14,100 --> 00:07:19,100 You know, shoulders or slant? 143 00:07:19,100 --> 00:07:20,100 Slant shoulder? 144 00:07:20,100 --> 00:07:21,100 Yeah, not square. 145 00:07:21,100 --> 00:07:23,100 Not square, it's slant. 146 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:27,100 What about the neck and the head and the shoulder? 147 00:07:27,100 --> 00:07:29,100 The neck was short. 148 00:07:29,100 --> 00:07:30,100 Sure. 149 00:07:30,100 --> 00:07:33,100 How about the body structure? 150 00:07:33,100 --> 00:07:36,100 All like a human. 151 00:07:36,100 --> 00:07:41,100 Arms, legs, even hands, you know. 152 00:07:41,100 --> 00:07:44,100 You didn't say anything up at the position of the hands, is it thinking that? 153 00:07:44,100 --> 00:07:46,100 The whole thing was... 154 00:07:46,100 --> 00:07:47,100 Now let me show you. 155 00:07:47,100 --> 00:07:49,100 Put it at the side, like so. 156 00:07:49,100 --> 00:07:50,100 It's down to the side. 157 00:07:50,100 --> 00:07:51,100 Not stuck to the sides? 158 00:07:51,100 --> 00:07:52,100 Not stuck. 159 00:07:52,100 --> 00:07:56,100 And it stood there in that position and it went up the same way? 160 00:07:56,100 --> 00:07:57,100 Went up the same way. 161 00:07:57,100 --> 00:07:59,100 Didn't even point that check and do anything? 162 00:07:59,100 --> 00:08:02,100 The only thing, the only movement was the head. 163 00:08:02,100 --> 00:08:03,100 It was the only thing that moved. 164 00:08:03,100 --> 00:08:06,100 Which turned from a right one to a left one for you. 165 00:08:06,100 --> 00:08:07,100 All right. 166 00:08:07,100 --> 00:08:09,100 Are you artistic? 167 00:08:09,100 --> 00:08:10,100 What do you mean? 168 00:08:10,100 --> 00:08:11,100 Can you draw? 169 00:08:11,100 --> 00:08:13,100 No, I can't draw. 170 00:08:13,100 --> 00:08:20,100 Well, can you just make the head, even if it's exaggerated with that pen? 171 00:08:20,100 --> 00:08:22,100 Now, how was it peculiar? 172 00:08:22,100 --> 00:08:24,100 It didn't have any ears. 173 00:08:24,100 --> 00:08:25,100 All right. 174 00:08:25,100 --> 00:08:28,100 That's the only thing that you noticed was peculiar. 175 00:08:28,100 --> 00:08:29,100 All right. 176 00:08:29,100 --> 00:08:31,100 There's no ears. 177 00:08:31,100 --> 00:08:35,100 But that shape of the jaws and everything else, that was normal to you. 178 00:08:35,100 --> 00:08:36,100 Rather normal. 179 00:08:36,100 --> 00:08:40,100 Yeah, it looked, like I said, like a little man. 180 00:08:40,100 --> 00:08:42,100 Now, how about the hair? 181 00:08:42,100 --> 00:08:44,100 It was no hair. 182 00:08:44,100 --> 00:08:45,100 Well, he was bald. 183 00:08:45,100 --> 00:08:46,100 I don't know. 184 00:08:46,100 --> 00:08:47,100 It was also... 185 00:08:47,100 --> 00:08:49,100 Well, you can tell if you had a cap on. 186 00:08:49,100 --> 00:08:53,100 Well, then if you had a cap on, then the visitors wouldn't show anyone. 187 00:08:53,100 --> 00:08:57,100 See, it was no ears or on the side. 188 00:08:57,100 --> 00:08:59,100 It was no impressions of any of it. 189 00:08:59,100 --> 00:09:00,100 It was just all smooth. 190 00:09:00,100 --> 00:09:04,100 But you still get the impression of a facial silver. 191 00:09:04,100 --> 00:09:05,100 Right. 192 00:09:05,100 --> 00:09:06,100 All right. 193 00:09:06,100 --> 00:09:10,100 What about this covering itself, this silveriness? 194 00:09:10,100 --> 00:09:13,100 Was there any bagginess in any places, like it was a garment? 195 00:09:13,100 --> 00:09:14,100 No. 196 00:09:14,100 --> 00:09:15,100 It was... 197 00:09:15,100 --> 00:09:25,100 I would rather say it was, I don't know, more like skin than a suit because it had one vein 198 00:09:25,100 --> 00:09:32,100 that ran down that was visible inside the arms, like a vein. 199 00:09:32,100 --> 00:09:33,100 One armor boot? 200 00:09:33,100 --> 00:09:34,100 Both. 201 00:09:34,100 --> 00:09:37,100 What about the feet and the legs? 202 00:09:37,100 --> 00:09:38,100 This is the thing. 203 00:09:38,100 --> 00:09:46,100 The feet, that had what was look like boots or shoes because it had a sole. 204 00:09:46,100 --> 00:09:52,740 And the reason why I could distinguish the sole is because when it went up, like the 205 00:09:52,740 --> 00:09:56,100 sole of the shoe was made, was that ridge. 206 00:09:56,100 --> 00:10:00,100 You know, it had a... 207 00:10:00,100 --> 00:10:02,100 Like so. 208 00:10:02,100 --> 00:10:05,100 And you couldn't see the toe. 209 00:10:05,100 --> 00:10:08,100 I'm telling you, this was the shoe. 210 00:10:08,100 --> 00:10:10,100 What about the boot area? 211 00:10:10,100 --> 00:10:11,100 How long was it? 212 00:10:11,100 --> 00:10:12,100 The boot top first. 213 00:10:12,100 --> 00:10:14,100 So it was a boot like... 214 00:10:14,100 --> 00:10:15,100 Short or long? 215 00:10:15,100 --> 00:10:16,100 It was short. 216 00:10:16,100 --> 00:10:19,100 There must have been a separation then there. 217 00:10:19,100 --> 00:10:20,100 Right. 218 00:10:20,100 --> 00:10:21,100 It was... 219 00:10:21,100 --> 00:10:22,100 It was... 220 00:10:22,100 --> 00:10:26,100 To hear to the boot like a shoe. 221 00:10:26,100 --> 00:10:28,100 You know, you could see the line. 222 00:10:28,100 --> 00:10:30,100 Above that there was no breaks at all. 223 00:10:30,100 --> 00:10:31,100 No breaks. 224 00:10:32,100 --> 00:10:41,100 Now, would you say this body was proportioned or the arms shorter or longer or normal portioned 225 00:10:41,100 --> 00:10:42,100 to the body? 226 00:10:42,100 --> 00:10:43,100 The... 227 00:10:43,100 --> 00:10:45,100 It's like kind of long. 228 00:10:45,100 --> 00:10:47,100 That seems a bit long too. 229 00:10:47,100 --> 00:10:48,100 Yeah. 230 00:10:48,100 --> 00:10:50,100 Did you feel any... 231 00:10:50,100 --> 00:10:52,100 Any danger? 232 00:10:52,100 --> 00:10:53,100 Any... 233 00:10:53,100 --> 00:10:56,100 Did it get to you somehow? 234 00:10:56,100 --> 00:11:01,100 You know, like I couldn't... 235 00:11:01,100 --> 00:11:04,100 A lot of thoughts went through my mind. 236 00:11:04,100 --> 00:11:07,100 First of all, like I couldn't believe what I was seeing. 237 00:11:07,100 --> 00:11:11,100 And then to this day, I still don't believe it. 238 00:11:11,100 --> 00:11:17,100 And are you in the habit of seeing things and not believing them? 239 00:11:17,100 --> 00:11:21,100 No, I'm not in the habit of seeing things and not believing them. 240 00:11:21,100 --> 00:11:28,100 Because see, I ain't never seen anything to believe out of the ordinary. 241 00:11:28,100 --> 00:11:29,100 You know? 242 00:11:29,100 --> 00:11:31,100 And to me this was an ordinary. 243 00:11:31,100 --> 00:11:36,100 Yeah, so in this case just because it's out of the ordinary then therefore you put it down 244 00:11:36,100 --> 00:11:38,100 in a questionable area. 245 00:11:38,100 --> 00:11:39,100 All right. 246 00:11:39,100 --> 00:11:47,100 Now see, like if I had, you know, after when I just got out and after this was over, I left. 247 00:11:47,100 --> 00:11:51,100 And usually no one rides with me. 248 00:11:51,100 --> 00:11:57,100 For once I wish I had a camera in somebody to witness what I witnessed. 249 00:11:57,100 --> 00:12:01,100 And you know, but then I say, well my mind's playing tricks. 250 00:12:01,100 --> 00:12:04,100 But then, you know, that was... 251 00:12:04,100 --> 00:12:06,100 You don't believe that either, huh? 252 00:12:06,100 --> 00:12:07,100 No. 253 00:12:07,100 --> 00:12:10,100 Because, you know, after thinking about it, my mind wasn't playing tricks. 254 00:12:10,100 --> 00:12:14,100 Everything that took place, I remember it, and I was completely awake. 255 00:12:14,100 --> 00:12:16,100 You smoke cigarettes? 256 00:12:16,100 --> 00:12:19,100 I smoke cigarettes, but it never caused me to have any kind of... 257 00:12:19,100 --> 00:12:21,100 No, that's what I'm asking. 258 00:12:21,100 --> 00:12:24,100 I just wondered what castle cigarettes you were smoking at the time. 259 00:12:24,100 --> 00:12:27,100 No, I wouldn't know herbs or marijuana. 260 00:12:27,100 --> 00:12:29,100 No, I think I'd say. 261 00:12:29,100 --> 00:12:34,100 Do you have any kind of a problem? 262 00:12:34,100 --> 00:12:36,100 I'm asking a very personal problem. 263 00:12:36,100 --> 00:12:38,100 I know, damn well, I'm gonna... 264 00:12:38,100 --> 00:12:40,100 You might get irritated, but I'm gonna ask anyway. 265 00:12:40,100 --> 00:12:45,100 Have you ever had a problem like many of the boys overseas with drugs? 266 00:12:45,100 --> 00:12:47,100 No, I never used drugs. 267 00:12:47,100 --> 00:12:49,100 Never used it. Too smart to use it. 268 00:12:49,100 --> 00:12:53,100 I never smoked pot, I never used no needles or popped any kind of pee. 269 00:12:53,100 --> 00:12:54,100 I'm just a smart fellow. 270 00:12:54,100 --> 00:13:03,100 I'm always interested, always interested in what does an experience like this do to you emotionally during the period of the experience? 271 00:13:03,100 --> 00:13:05,100 That's what I'm saying. 272 00:13:05,100 --> 00:13:10,100 Well, from the two of you I witnessed this. 273 00:13:10,100 --> 00:13:14,100 You know, I guess it was, I walked to the fence, and I went through my mind. 274 00:13:14,100 --> 00:13:18,100 Such as, such as one, is this for real? 275 00:13:18,100 --> 00:13:21,100 And two, no it isn't. 276 00:13:21,100 --> 00:13:25,100 And just what the hell is going on? 277 00:13:25,100 --> 00:13:27,100 I figured somebody might have been playing the joke. 278 00:13:27,100 --> 00:13:33,100 You know, but then I said, no, it was too elaborate. 279 00:13:33,100 --> 00:13:36,100 You know, to be a joke, I mean, you know. 280 00:13:36,100 --> 00:13:38,100 It would never be a hard joke to pull. 281 00:13:38,100 --> 00:13:40,100 You know, I looked at it from all aspects, you know. 282 00:13:40,100 --> 00:13:42,100 How can you lower something? 283 00:13:42,100 --> 00:13:46,100 You know, it couldn't, it wasn't no chopper because there wasn't no sound. 284 00:13:46,100 --> 00:13:49,100 And a chopper would make, you know, no sound whatsoever. 285 00:13:49,100 --> 00:13:50,100 No sound. 286 00:13:50,100 --> 00:13:55,100 This is, you know, some of my logic I put together, you know, it couldn't have been a helicopter. 287 00:13:55,100 --> 00:13:58,100 You know, I would have heard the blades spinning. 288 00:13:58,100 --> 00:13:59,100 You used the head, don't you? 289 00:13:59,100 --> 00:14:00,100 Right. 290 00:14:00,100 --> 00:14:07,100 And it was no visible wire ropes on this guy. 291 00:14:07,100 --> 00:14:09,100 How did this thing always appear? 292 00:14:09,100 --> 00:14:11,100 It went on the same way that it came down. 293 00:14:11,100 --> 00:14:12,100 It went up. 294 00:14:12,100 --> 00:14:15,100 And as it got, you know, under the lights and that was it. 295 00:14:15,100 --> 00:14:16,100 It was gone. 296 00:14:16,100 --> 00:14:17,100 Then what? 297 00:14:17,100 --> 00:14:18,100 You know, it was gone. 298 00:14:18,100 --> 00:14:19,100 But what about the lights? 299 00:14:19,100 --> 00:14:23,100 It was still, the lights were still there, still blinking. 300 00:14:23,100 --> 00:14:32,100 And then when the, when this guy disappeared, you know, I guess, you know, a split second or whatever it was. 301 00:14:32,100 --> 00:14:33,100 It wouldn't have long. 302 00:14:33,100 --> 00:14:35,100 I wouldn't even say two seconds. 303 00:14:35,100 --> 00:14:48,100 But when he disappeared a very short time after that, the lights moved forward and stopped, came to a dead stop like this and straight on up. 304 00:14:48,100 --> 00:14:55,100 And when it went up, the car rocked like as if a semi was passing. 305 00:14:55,100 --> 00:14:59,100 In other words, there was a horizontal movement away and then a vertical straight up. 306 00:14:59,100 --> 00:15:02,100 You say it was four and a half feet in front of you. 307 00:15:02,100 --> 00:15:07,100 I looked at that the other day and I say, now I'm the distance. 308 00:15:07,100 --> 00:15:16,100 I misjudged, you know, to me thinking close, but then look, they say, well, it's got to be at least 10. 309 00:15:16,100 --> 00:15:19,100 All right. Now, is there possibly, you say at least 10 feet? 310 00:15:19,100 --> 00:15:21,100 I have to say at least 10. 311 00:15:21,100 --> 00:15:26,100 Do you, do you change the size of the object or the, you know, I still don't change that size. 312 00:15:26,100 --> 00:15:27,100 No. 313 00:15:27,100 --> 00:15:31,100 Like I say, this thing was one more two feet tall. 314 00:15:31,100 --> 00:15:35,100 You know, I say anywhere from 24 to 28 inches. 315 00:15:35,100 --> 00:15:44,100 You know, if you were looking in the end of the windshield and you were looking at the lights and you said they were pretty much up in the air like this 90 degrees will be right over here. 316 00:15:44,100 --> 00:15:52,100 But still over there, according to what you said, if it did come down onto the street, it had to be fairly, pretty close. 317 00:15:52,100 --> 00:16:02,100 The thing about it is, if your estimate is right at 100 yard, I mean 100 feet up, about how much of the windshield does these lights take up? 318 00:16:02,100 --> 00:16:05,100 What would cover it? 319 00:16:05,100 --> 00:16:09,100 How much of the windshield? You got a windshield that white, okay? 320 00:16:09,100 --> 00:16:10,100 Right. 321 00:16:10,100 --> 00:16:11,100 And you got one about that high. 322 00:16:11,100 --> 00:16:12,100 Right. 323 00:16:12,100 --> 00:16:14,100 How much of that windshield does it take up? 324 00:16:14,100 --> 00:16:16,100 They say about half. 325 00:16:16,100 --> 00:16:17,100 Looking through. 326 00:16:17,100 --> 00:16:19,100 The lights took up half the windshield. 327 00:16:19,100 --> 00:16:21,100 You know, the lengthwise, you mean from each edge? 328 00:16:21,100 --> 00:16:22,100 With. 329 00:16:22,100 --> 00:16:23,100 With. 330 00:16:23,100 --> 00:16:24,100 Yeah. 331 00:16:24,100 --> 00:16:25,100 Looking right. 332 00:16:25,100 --> 00:16:26,100 A half. 333 00:16:26,100 --> 00:16:27,100 Yeah, half that windshield. 334 00:16:27,100 --> 00:16:29,100 Then what about up and down? 335 00:16:29,100 --> 00:16:30,100 What do you mean? 336 00:16:30,100 --> 00:16:34,100 Well, if it's like, what about this way? 337 00:16:34,100 --> 00:16:38,100 What about this way? Does it take up the full width of the windshield up and down? 338 00:16:38,100 --> 00:16:39,100 No. 339 00:16:39,100 --> 00:16:40,100 How much of it? 340 00:16:40,100 --> 00:16:41,100 What fraction? 341 00:16:41,100 --> 00:16:46,100 Like, I don't know how to explain that. 342 00:16:46,100 --> 00:16:47,100 I don't know. 343 00:16:47,100 --> 00:16:48,100 Yeah. 344 00:16:48,100 --> 00:16:51,100 You can use that for a windshield right here, okay? 345 00:16:51,100 --> 00:16:53,100 You can use the right half there. 346 00:16:53,100 --> 00:16:55,100 You can do it yourself. 347 00:16:55,100 --> 00:16:56,100 Yeah. 348 00:16:56,100 --> 00:16:59,100 Like, this is the windshield. 349 00:16:59,100 --> 00:17:00,100 Yeah. 350 00:17:00,100 --> 00:17:01,100 Looking. 351 00:17:01,100 --> 00:17:08,100 That has to be the stainless. 352 00:17:08,100 --> 00:17:10,100 The stainless. 353 00:17:10,100 --> 00:17:14,100 Do you seem to be this way? 354 00:17:14,100 --> 00:17:16,100 In that kind of a fashion? 355 00:17:16,100 --> 00:17:17,100 Yeah. 356 00:17:17,100 --> 00:17:18,100 You're hanging down that naked? 357 00:17:18,100 --> 00:17:19,100 No, I wouldn't hang. 358 00:17:19,100 --> 00:17:24,100 And what I mean is this kind of a pear shaped down, you know, a shape like the lights was 359 00:17:24,100 --> 00:17:27,100 like, but did you ever see the whole thing? 360 00:17:27,100 --> 00:17:28,100 Yeah, this is what I'm saying. 361 00:17:28,100 --> 00:17:31,100 This is what the whole thing, this is what I'm saying like this. 362 00:17:31,100 --> 00:17:34,100 I can't make a dynamic drawing. 363 00:17:34,100 --> 00:17:35,100 What? 364 00:17:35,100 --> 00:17:38,100 Nothing but lights, just like this shape like that. 365 00:17:38,100 --> 00:17:40,100 Were the lights on both sides of it? 366 00:17:40,100 --> 00:17:42,100 The whole thing, this whole area. 367 00:17:42,100 --> 00:17:44,100 Put lights on where they are. 368 00:17:44,100 --> 00:17:46,100 Well, this whole thing like this. 369 00:17:46,100 --> 00:17:47,100 Like neon. 370 00:17:47,100 --> 00:17:48,100 Like this here. 371 00:17:48,100 --> 00:17:49,100 You mean continuous light? 372 00:17:49,100 --> 00:17:50,100 The whole thing, right. 373 00:17:50,100 --> 00:17:57,100 This thing here turned from, it went to red, to blue, to white. 374 00:17:57,100 --> 00:17:59,100 Now, did the whole craft changes? 375 00:17:59,100 --> 00:18:01,100 Or was it just lights? 376 00:18:01,100 --> 00:18:02,100 You know, it's just this. 377 00:18:02,100 --> 00:18:04,100 What are you talking about, Leitjo? 378 00:18:04,100 --> 00:18:09,100 Are you talking about individual discernible lights or just one light? 379 00:18:09,100 --> 00:18:11,100 Like, we'll put a light. 380 00:18:11,100 --> 00:18:14,100 I'm talking about three lights, three colors, right? 381 00:18:14,100 --> 00:18:16,100 This whole thing here, right? 382 00:18:16,100 --> 00:18:20,100 Red, blue, white, red, blue, white. 383 00:18:20,100 --> 00:18:22,100 Well, you see what I'm getting at? 384 00:18:22,100 --> 00:18:30,100 If you talk about lights, now let's say for instance we have a red light, a blue light, a white light, and they're just separately going on and off. 385 00:18:30,100 --> 00:18:32,100 That wouldn't be that way it is then? 386 00:18:32,100 --> 00:18:33,100 Yeah, they're separately. 387 00:18:33,100 --> 00:18:36,100 You know, this whole thing is red and white, you know. 388 00:18:36,100 --> 00:18:38,100 For red ones, and then blue and then white. 389 00:18:38,100 --> 00:18:40,100 In other words, the whole thing is one color. 390 00:18:40,100 --> 00:18:42,100 It was just going one color. 391 00:18:42,100 --> 00:18:44,100 In other words, it's just an object changing colors then. 392 00:18:44,100 --> 00:18:46,100 Right, it was just all changing. 393 00:18:46,100 --> 00:18:48,100 And then there's no flashing lights like you said. 394 00:18:48,100 --> 00:18:51,100 No, it's just like a flash, you know. 395 00:18:51,100 --> 00:18:55,100 What I'm saying, a flash to blue, a flash to white. 396 00:18:55,100 --> 00:18:57,100 Right, it's just like that. 397 00:18:57,100 --> 00:18:59,100 It's not multiple colors at one time. 398 00:18:59,100 --> 00:19:01,100 Well, you said something like psychedelic lights. 399 00:19:01,100 --> 00:19:04,100 Yeah, listen, I mean, you know, just a flash, you know. 400 00:19:04,100 --> 00:19:06,100 How fast? 401 00:19:06,100 --> 00:19:11,100 Go ahead and say blink, blink, blink, especially if you want to, as far as that light is concerned. 402 00:19:11,100 --> 00:19:14,100 It'd be blink, blink, blink, blink, blink, blink, blink. 403 00:19:14,100 --> 00:19:17,100 And changing the colors. 404 00:19:17,100 --> 00:19:19,100 The colors are just red, white, and blue. 405 00:19:19,100 --> 00:19:21,100 Red, white, blue. 406 00:19:21,100 --> 00:19:22,100 Red, blue, and white. 407 00:19:22,100 --> 00:19:25,100 How's that not red, blue, and white? 408 00:19:25,100 --> 00:19:28,100 Yeah, red, blue, and white. It's just one constant path. 409 00:19:28,100 --> 00:19:30,100 What makes you so sure about the color changes? 410 00:19:30,100 --> 00:19:31,100 Red, blue, and white. 411 00:19:31,100 --> 00:19:33,100 Because that took a good look. 412 00:19:33,100 --> 00:19:35,100 That's why I know that's pretty hard to remember. 413 00:19:35,100 --> 00:19:37,100 You know, when you've got three colors like that. 414 00:19:37,100 --> 00:19:39,100 No, I didn't forget them. 415 00:19:39,100 --> 00:19:41,100 Because it was a... 416 00:19:41,100 --> 00:19:43,100 All-Patreonic was. 417 00:19:43,100 --> 00:19:45,100 Oh, you're fine. 418 00:19:45,100 --> 00:19:47,100 I don't know how to say. 419 00:19:47,100 --> 00:19:50,100 This is the color at a turn, you know. 420 00:19:50,100 --> 00:19:52,100 Red, blue, and white. 421 00:19:52,100 --> 00:19:53,100 All right. 422 00:19:53,100 --> 00:19:55,100 Okay, so you drove away from there. 423 00:19:55,100 --> 00:19:59,100 Did you...you didn't stop to take a look to see whether there was any kind of a mark on the street? 424 00:19:59,100 --> 00:20:00,100 No. 425 00:20:00,100 --> 00:20:02,100 I just love it. 426 00:20:02,100 --> 00:20:03,100 Scared? 427 00:20:03,100 --> 00:20:05,100 Yeah, I'm a little bit scared. 428 00:20:05,100 --> 00:20:07,100 Just to be watered. 429 00:20:07,100 --> 00:20:09,100 And then just to try to... 430 00:20:09,100 --> 00:20:11,100 Did you come right and watered? 431 00:20:11,100 --> 00:20:13,100 Yeah, I came in and thought about it. 432 00:20:13,100 --> 00:20:15,100 I thought about another way from the time I was seeing it. 433 00:20:15,100 --> 00:20:17,100 Thought I got in here. 434 00:20:17,100 --> 00:20:19,100 And then, you know, I tried to call some... 435 00:20:19,100 --> 00:20:21,100 The airport and say, you know, 436 00:20:21,100 --> 00:20:26,100 you can jam any helicopters or anything in the area, you know. 437 00:20:26,100 --> 00:20:28,100 On radar. 438 00:20:28,100 --> 00:20:30,100 The last 10, 15, 20 minutes. 439 00:20:30,100 --> 00:20:32,100 You got it? 440 00:20:32,100 --> 00:20:33,100 You did call them? 441 00:20:33,100 --> 00:20:36,100 Yeah, the guy told me, well, we don't have no radar. 442 00:20:36,100 --> 00:20:38,100 Well, which airport did you call? 443 00:20:38,100 --> 00:20:41,100 I called the Acklin-Nop municipal. 444 00:20:41,100 --> 00:20:42,100 Oh, yeah. 445 00:20:42,100 --> 00:20:43,100 No, they don't have. 446 00:20:43,100 --> 00:20:45,100 And the guy said they didn't have any. 447 00:20:45,100 --> 00:20:50,100 And then I tried to call Acklin County, but you couldn't get to the tower. 448 00:20:50,100 --> 00:20:52,100 You know, they say, well, call the weather bureau. 449 00:20:52,100 --> 00:20:54,100 And it was a recording that came on. 450 00:20:54,100 --> 00:20:57,100 All right, so, you know, it does... 451 00:20:57,100 --> 00:21:00,100 So how did you learn about our number? 452 00:21:00,100 --> 00:21:01,100 Right across the hall. 453 00:21:01,100 --> 00:21:07,100 I told him, you know, and it was him, Earl Whitman. 454 00:21:07,100 --> 00:21:11,100 He said, well, he ported to the UFO committee. 455 00:21:11,100 --> 00:21:15,100 And I said, I never heard of him until he told me. 456 00:21:15,100 --> 00:21:18,100 He said it was in the phone book. 457 00:21:18,100 --> 00:21:21,100 So, you know, I told him. 458 00:21:21,100 --> 00:21:23,100 Why did he know that? 459 00:21:23,100 --> 00:21:26,100 I mean, how's it come to know about this? 460 00:21:26,100 --> 00:21:27,100 Who, Earl? 461 00:21:27,100 --> 00:21:29,100 I don't know. 462 00:21:29,100 --> 00:21:30,100 I mean, I don't know. 463 00:21:30,100 --> 00:21:31,100 I don't know. 464 00:21:31,100 --> 00:21:32,100 I don't know. 465 00:21:32,100 --> 00:21:35,100 You might have glanced, but he knows, you know, a lot of organizations I've never even heard of. 466 00:21:35,100 --> 00:21:36,100 Yeah. 467 00:21:36,100 --> 00:21:40,100 So you called me directly instead of calling anybody else. 468 00:21:40,100 --> 00:21:46,100 Yeah, I just looked and, you know, I told him his style of the number. 469 00:21:46,100 --> 00:21:48,100 Well, now there's three numbers in there. 470 00:21:48,100 --> 00:21:53,100 Now that these four or five days have gone by, 471 00:21:54,100 --> 00:21:57,100 do you have any reflections on this experience? 472 00:21:57,100 --> 00:21:59,100 I haven't dreamed about it a couple of times. 473 00:21:59,100 --> 00:22:00,100 You'd have dreamed about it? 474 00:22:00,100 --> 00:22:01,100 Yeah. 475 00:22:01,100 --> 00:22:02,100 I've dreamed about it. 476 00:22:02,100 --> 00:22:07,100 Well, now do the dreams take on any avid fantasies here? 477 00:22:07,100 --> 00:22:09,100 Or are they pretty true to the facts? 478 00:22:09,100 --> 00:22:10,100 Stuff. 479 00:22:10,100 --> 00:22:11,100 Oh, what I say. 480 00:22:11,100 --> 00:22:15,100 You know, like I say, you know, that's not what we usually dream, you know. 481 00:22:15,100 --> 00:22:17,100 Dreams are very subtle. 482 00:22:17,100 --> 00:22:19,100 Dreams are very subtle. 483 00:22:19,100 --> 00:22:21,100 I say, you know, that's not what we usually dreams are. 484 00:22:21,100 --> 00:22:24,100 Dreams are very subtle, more accurate. 485 00:22:24,100 --> 00:22:27,100 You know, what I'm saying is what I encounter, you know. 486 00:22:27,100 --> 00:22:30,100 You have dreams just like that exactly the same way? 487 00:22:30,100 --> 00:22:31,100 Yeah. 488 00:22:31,100 --> 00:22:34,100 I can tell you that, you know, I got a superb memory. 489 00:22:34,100 --> 00:22:39,100 Well, I'm not saying you haven't, but I say when you have a dream, very subtle, do you have an exact dream? 490 00:22:39,100 --> 00:22:41,100 Because your brain adds things to it. 491 00:22:41,100 --> 00:22:42,100 It's very subtle. 492 00:22:42,100 --> 00:22:44,100 It's an accurate thing. 493 00:22:44,100 --> 00:22:48,100 It gets mixed up with other things that happened during the day because, you know, what appears to be about a minute in a dream, 494 00:22:48,100 --> 00:22:52,100 to you, may appear to be ours, you know, or even a couple of ours, for that matter. 495 00:22:52,100 --> 00:22:55,100 And so therefore, I'm wondering how you're getting this dream so accurate. 496 00:22:55,100 --> 00:22:57,100 It's the same thing. 497 00:22:57,100 --> 00:22:59,100 The same way I see it. 498 00:22:59,100 --> 00:23:00,100 Can I ask another question? 499 00:23:00,100 --> 00:23:01,100 Yeah. 500 00:23:01,100 --> 00:23:03,100 Do you dream about anything else? 501 00:23:03,100 --> 00:23:07,100 Things that have happened to me. 502 00:23:07,100 --> 00:23:09,100 You know, that's my subconscious. 503 00:23:09,100 --> 00:23:15,100 You know, things that are in the back of my mind that have happened to me. 504 00:23:15,100 --> 00:23:17,100 Sure, I'm getting the problem. 505 00:23:17,100 --> 00:23:21,100 Well, what I mean is, is there anything? 506 00:23:21,100 --> 00:23:26,100 Would you place any importance on dreams? 507 00:23:26,100 --> 00:23:28,100 No, I don't place them on dreams. 508 00:23:28,100 --> 00:23:36,100 You know, these are just, to me, thoughts that night, subconsciously I'm thinking about. 509 00:23:36,100 --> 00:23:42,100 Do you place any credence in these ideas in which some of these people say that dreams are actually poor tell? 510 00:23:43,100 --> 00:23:49,100 The future and all that and events and the phenomenal things, no, I guess say, you know. 511 00:23:49,100 --> 00:23:51,100 Nothing like that has ever happened to you? 512 00:23:51,100 --> 00:23:55,100 I don't believe in, like I say, ghosts and all that. 513 00:23:55,100 --> 00:23:58,100 Yeah, the devil and all these. 514 00:23:58,100 --> 00:23:59,100 Not even the devil? 515 00:23:59,100 --> 00:24:02,100 No, I don't believe in that. 516 00:24:02,100 --> 00:24:05,100 You know, demons and all that crap. 517 00:24:05,100 --> 00:24:07,100 I don't believe in that. 518 00:24:07,100 --> 00:24:09,100 Do you have a religion that you follow? 519 00:24:09,100 --> 00:24:11,100 I mean, a denomination, you know. 520 00:24:11,100 --> 00:24:15,100 Southern Baptist or Protestant or Catholic or what? 521 00:24:15,100 --> 00:24:16,100 Baptist. 522 00:24:16,100 --> 00:24:18,100 You go to church someplace? 523 00:24:18,100 --> 00:24:19,100 Yeah. 524 00:24:19,100 --> 00:24:20,100 Which one? 525 00:24:20,100 --> 00:24:21,100 Shaggle Baptist. 526 00:24:21,100 --> 00:24:22,100 Is that in Durham? 527 00:24:22,100 --> 00:24:23,100 Yeah, it's on Grand Street. 528 00:24:23,100 --> 00:24:25,100 I'm making a parents' now and then. 529 00:24:25,100 --> 00:24:30,100 You're the most Baptist, aren't you? 530 00:24:30,100 --> 00:24:32,100 Well, okay, I just wondered. 531 00:24:32,100 --> 00:24:37,100 You don't have any, you read anything about UFOs? 532 00:24:37,100 --> 00:24:40,100 Do you have books on the subject or do you get anything out of the library? 533 00:24:40,100 --> 00:24:42,100 Are you interested in the subject? 534 00:24:42,100 --> 00:24:46,100 Before this time, before this event? 535 00:24:46,100 --> 00:24:47,100 No. 536 00:24:47,100 --> 00:24:56,100 Did you think that people who have any kind of serious thoughts about it were a little off the rock or anything like that? 537 00:24:56,100 --> 00:24:58,100 I put it like this. 538 00:24:58,100 --> 00:25:02,100 I never gave it too much thought, you know. 539 00:25:02,100 --> 00:25:05,100 It's just something I never believed in. 540 00:25:05,100 --> 00:25:07,100 Well, what is your feeling about it now? 541 00:25:07,100 --> 00:25:10,100 If you put an interpretation on what you saw. 542 00:25:10,100 --> 00:25:12,100 Yeah, I still don't believe. 543 00:25:12,100 --> 00:25:14,100 Do you believe that you saw what you saw? 544 00:25:14,100 --> 00:25:18,100 I don't believe, you know, it's... 545 00:25:18,100 --> 00:25:19,100 What don't you believe? 546 00:25:19,100 --> 00:25:22,100 You already got your mind made up what the other people believe? 547 00:25:22,100 --> 00:25:23,100 Pardon? 548 00:25:23,100 --> 00:25:27,100 Do you already have your mind made up as to what other people believe? 549 00:25:27,100 --> 00:25:28,100 No. 550 00:25:28,100 --> 00:25:30,100 What don't you believe? 551 00:25:30,100 --> 00:25:32,100 You said you believed your own self all go. 552 00:25:32,100 --> 00:25:33,100 Yeah, I believe that. 553 00:25:33,100 --> 00:25:35,100 No, I believe what I say. 554 00:25:35,100 --> 00:25:36,100 What don't you believe? 555 00:25:36,100 --> 00:25:47,100 I don't believe what you might say, you know, something like outer space or, you know... 556 00:25:47,100 --> 00:25:49,100 What do you mean outer space right now? 557 00:25:49,100 --> 00:25:52,100 I'm talking about, you know, some other form of life from outer space. 558 00:25:52,100 --> 00:25:55,100 Well, you certainly saw some other form of life. 559 00:25:55,100 --> 00:25:56,100 Wait a minute, Larry. 560 00:25:56,100 --> 00:25:57,100 Wait a minute, Larry. 561 00:25:57,100 --> 00:26:00,100 You see, that's the whole thing that's what I was getting at. 562 00:26:00,100 --> 00:26:05,100 That doesn't mean just because Larry and I here are working on the undefined flying 563 00:26:05,100 --> 00:26:10,100 object, the nature, that we actually can put our finger down as to a positive, even anything 564 00:26:10,100 --> 00:26:12,100 outside of our own world. 565 00:26:12,100 --> 00:26:16,100 Does that mean it's not possible that this could have been of our own world? 566 00:26:16,100 --> 00:26:18,100 Ah, yeah, it could be. 567 00:26:18,100 --> 00:26:21,100 Have you ever heard of anything like this before? 568 00:26:21,100 --> 00:26:25,100 In your own recollection from reading and things of nature? 569 00:26:25,100 --> 00:26:27,100 I don't know why. 570 00:26:27,100 --> 00:26:29,100 Creatures such as this. 571 00:26:29,100 --> 00:26:31,100 Have you ever heard of a... 572 00:26:31,100 --> 00:26:32,100 Matt, don't... 573 00:26:32,100 --> 00:26:33,100 ...somewhere experience? 574 00:26:33,100 --> 00:26:37,100 Have you ever heard of a similar experience? 575 00:26:37,100 --> 00:26:43,100 Ah, like, you know, I heard of people saying things. 576 00:26:43,100 --> 00:26:45,100 Is this what you're getting at? 577 00:26:45,100 --> 00:26:50,100 Have you heard of anyone having an experience similar to the one that you have? 578 00:26:50,100 --> 00:26:51,100 No. 579 00:26:51,100 --> 00:26:56,100 One other thing, in the own experience from reading, from going to high school, from 580 00:26:56,100 --> 00:27:02,100 reading any books that you might have read, do you know of any possibility that this thing 581 00:27:02,100 --> 00:27:05,100 might have been something of the earth? 582 00:27:05,100 --> 00:27:06,100 That's my imagination. 583 00:27:06,100 --> 00:27:11,100 No, no, of the earth. 584 00:27:11,100 --> 00:27:14,100 Inhabitant of the earth, in other words. 585 00:27:14,100 --> 00:27:21,100 What in the back of your mind might there be a storage cell back there of your memory? 586 00:27:21,100 --> 00:27:25,100 What might there be that might give you some indication as to if this thing is not 587 00:27:25,100 --> 00:27:27,100 outer space, like you say. 588 00:27:27,100 --> 00:27:33,100 If it's not extra-stressual, then it must be limited to our own sphere of living here, right here on earth, right? 589 00:27:33,100 --> 00:27:39,100 So therefore, have you ever heard of anything that resembles this kind of a thing? 590 00:27:39,100 --> 00:27:41,100 Damn, I'm just a phenomenon. 591 00:27:41,100 --> 00:27:43,100 That's all I could say. 592 00:27:43,100 --> 00:27:45,100 I mean, I can't really... 593 00:27:45,100 --> 00:27:53,100 What I'm saying, I can't base it whether, you know, if you want to get, you know, outer space in this world and all this, you know... 594 00:27:54,100 --> 00:28:00,100 I really can't put it, you know, of what it was, but whatever it was is a damn good trick. 595 00:28:00,100 --> 00:28:02,100 Did you ever hear of leprechauns? 596 00:28:02,100 --> 00:28:03,100 Yeah, I heard of leprechauns. 597 00:28:03,100 --> 00:28:04,100 That's what I was driving at. 598 00:28:04,100 --> 00:28:09,100 I was wondering if you were, you know, you would answer in that direction. 599 00:28:09,100 --> 00:28:13,100 Now, what people do the leprechauns usually associate with? 600 00:28:13,100 --> 00:28:16,100 I mean, what people usually report them the most? 601 00:28:16,100 --> 00:28:17,100 On Irish. 602 00:28:17,100 --> 00:28:18,100 On Irish. That's right. 603 00:28:18,100 --> 00:28:22,100 That's right. And see, there's a lot of this in the background. 604 00:28:22,100 --> 00:28:23,100 See, that's what I was driving at. 605 00:28:23,100 --> 00:28:25,100 I wonder if you knew anything about this kind of a thing. 606 00:28:25,100 --> 00:28:33,100 Yeah, but leprechauns, you know, I'd have to catch one to get the pot of gold with farts. 607 00:28:33,100 --> 00:28:36,100 I really don't believe in them, you know. 608 00:28:36,100 --> 00:28:39,100 At the same time, they are small creatures, right? 609 00:28:39,100 --> 00:28:41,100 And they're human-like, right? 610 00:28:41,100 --> 00:28:44,100 They're not perfectly proportionate as we are, but they are human-like. 611 00:28:44,100 --> 00:28:50,100 They, if they are, if they do exist, they exist with all the various organs in the brain and everything else like we have, right? 612 00:28:50,100 --> 00:28:53,100 But this thing that you saw was also small. 613 00:28:53,100 --> 00:29:03,100 And just because it used something to carry it to a certain spot and drop down, does that necessarily put it outside of the same realm as leprechauns? 614 00:29:03,100 --> 00:29:10,100 Yeah. If you want to get, you know, magic and all that, you know. 615 00:29:10,100 --> 00:29:13,100 You don't have a, you don't have much belief in that kind of thing. 616 00:29:13,100 --> 00:29:22,100 I wonder why those people in the past, so many have wrote about this subject just as strongly as you're writing about it right now. 617 00:29:22,100 --> 00:29:24,100 You're writing right on this telepathy report. 618 00:29:24,100 --> 00:29:29,100 And they wrote the same way. That's to find the same way as you are as to what they saw. 619 00:29:29,100 --> 00:29:31,100 This has been going on for hundreds of years. 620 00:29:31,100 --> 00:29:32,100 No. 621 00:29:32,100 --> 00:29:39,100 Yeah, I get it. You know, are they believable or any more or any less than you are? You see what I mean? 622 00:29:39,100 --> 00:29:50,100 Well, I'll put it like this. You know, if I could, you know, had witnesses or some kind of proof, you know, that I could verify. 623 00:29:50,100 --> 00:29:52,100 I can't believe that we, but I do. 624 00:29:52,100 --> 00:30:00,100 I, you know, I don't have it, you know, so I can't too much believe in it. 625 00:30:00,100 --> 00:30:06,100 You know, I might go for a picture or a re-accounted with somebody that witnessed it with me. 626 00:30:06,100 --> 00:30:20,100 But just me, I tell you, it would only be true if I don't know what to believe. You know, there's so many phases I could think of, you know, if you took your short time to get to where I'm at. 627 00:30:20,100 --> 00:30:21,100 What is it? 628 00:30:21,100 --> 00:30:25,100 Thirty years of interest and 14 years of investigation. 629 00:30:25,100 --> 00:30:28,100 Do you think I don't know what to believe either? 630 00:30:28,100 --> 00:30:36,100 Not now, of course, being speculative, like we've been playing around here and I see what Mark was now trying to get at. 631 00:30:36,100 --> 00:30:44,100 You did see a creature as Mark suggests, which could maybe fall in the leprechaun category of things. 632 00:30:44,100 --> 00:30:51,100 Now, I don't know of anything in folklore which brings leprechauns in football-shaped objects. 633 00:30:51,100 --> 00:30:52,100 No, I don't. 634 00:30:52,100 --> 00:30:53,100 This, of course, is your... 635 00:30:53,100 --> 00:31:00,100 It doesn't mean leprechauns have to remain the technological oaths they've always been. Why can't they advance the same as anybody else? 636 00:31:00,100 --> 00:31:01,100 What the heck? 637 00:31:01,100 --> 00:31:08,100 I mean, if in the days of the leprechauns, the Irish were going around in horse and boogie, the Irish are not going around in horse and boogie today. 638 00:31:08,100 --> 00:31:10,100 Why don't the leprechauns remain horse and boogie people? 639 00:31:10,100 --> 00:31:13,100 Yeah, well, you see how this folklore could go in many directions. 640 00:31:13,100 --> 00:31:19,100 Now, did the leprechauns indeed originate in Ireland or was they indeed from outer space? 641 00:31:19,100 --> 00:31:21,100 And did they just make their visitations, you know? 642 00:31:21,100 --> 00:31:22,100 They go in there. 643 00:31:22,100 --> 00:31:25,100 Right. And well, not necessarily. This folklore goes all over the world, really. 644 00:31:25,100 --> 00:31:26,100 It does? 645 00:31:26,100 --> 00:31:27,100 Oh, it certainly does. 646 00:31:27,100 --> 00:31:29,100 It does go all over the world. 647 00:31:29,100 --> 00:31:38,100 I don't know why you even brought it up. The only reason I brought it up is because you've got a little creature, and there are little creatures in history, the folklore of the nations that were. 648 00:31:38,100 --> 00:31:39,100 Sure. 649 00:31:39,100 --> 00:31:48,100 Well, of course, he has just completed a couple of years ago a book on all types of folklore of this type. 650 00:31:48,100 --> 00:31:53,100 And of course, he integrates it with the entire UFO phenomena. 651 00:31:53,100 --> 00:31:56,100 And these are the reasons why. 652 00:31:56,100 --> 00:32:03,100 But because we are in your shoes, we don't really know what the final interpretation will or can be. 653 00:32:03,100 --> 00:32:09,100 We're trying to pull together all the data from all the source that we can in hopes that it will one day make some sense. 654 00:32:09,100 --> 00:32:15,100 They're sure keeping our us in a bind, I'll tell you, whatever it is. 655 00:32:15,100 --> 00:32:18,100 We've been doing this for very many years. 656 00:32:18,100 --> 00:32:31,100 Well, I could say, really, if I had a photograph, you know, if I just had a camera and got a picture, you know. 657 00:32:31,100 --> 00:32:35,100 It didn't feel that it was bright enough that it would have recorded on a normal camera. 658 00:32:35,100 --> 00:32:36,100 Yeah. 659 00:32:36,100 --> 00:32:40,100 Does the lights themselves light up the ground area? 660 00:32:40,100 --> 00:32:43,100 Right. The day they did light up the ground area. 661 00:32:43,100 --> 00:32:45,100 100 feet. They lit up the street. 662 00:32:45,100 --> 00:32:48,100 That's right. That's right. 663 00:32:48,100 --> 00:32:53,100 Is that how I noticed it, you know, off the the lid of the car? 664 00:32:53,100 --> 00:33:01,100 Mark, I would like very, very much sometime when Mr. Todd has time to ride along out with us to the spot. 665 00:33:01,100 --> 00:33:04,100 I went out and I'm not too sure that I was exactly. 666 00:33:04,100 --> 00:33:07,100 43. Now he thinks I know that now. 667 00:33:07,100 --> 00:33:09,100 Oh, I know where the spot is. 668 00:33:09,100 --> 00:33:11,100 I know it perfectly. 669 00:33:11,100 --> 00:33:18,100 So it's just too bad that we don't have a, you know, we don't have you in person right there because it might be important. 670 00:33:18,100 --> 00:33:25,100 But I I am of great doubt that at this time is that what is that a well traveled road out there? 671 00:33:25,100 --> 00:33:29,100 Would you say that, let's say, for instance, since that time, 1000 cars have passed. 672 00:33:29,100 --> 00:33:30,100 Yeah, that's right. 673 00:33:30,100 --> 00:33:33,100 That would have destroyed any evidence on the ground. 674 00:33:33,100 --> 00:33:35,100 I'd say that. 675 00:33:35,100 --> 00:33:38,100 Turner tracks would have passed right over that thing a million times. 676 00:33:38,100 --> 00:33:43,100 Now, on the descent, how long a period did the descent take? Could you guess? 677 00:33:43,100 --> 00:33:46,100 You know, how fast did it come down? 678 00:33:47,100 --> 00:33:51,100 I'll say I'll say go and you say stop when it hits the street. OK. 679 00:33:51,100 --> 00:33:53,100 Go. 680 00:33:56,100 --> 00:33:58,100 Just five seconds. 681 00:33:58,100 --> 00:34:05,100 And this would be a hundred feet and five seconds, 20 people a second, which was a pretty fast descent. 682 00:34:05,100 --> 00:34:08,100 Did he seem to actually touch the ground? 683 00:34:08,100 --> 00:34:09,100 Yeah. 684 00:34:09,100 --> 00:34:11,100 Was there any jar? 685 00:34:11,100 --> 00:34:14,100 No, just like our car. 686 00:34:14,100 --> 00:34:17,100 You setting it microphone. 687 00:34:17,100 --> 00:34:21,100 And that, you know, it's completely standing up. 688 00:34:21,100 --> 00:34:27,100 It's one for one for the 16 miles an hour. He's going about 14 miles an hour when he hit. 689 00:34:27,100 --> 00:34:30,100 Did he slow down at all before he touched? 690 00:34:30,100 --> 00:34:32,100 No. In other words, he had 14 miles an hour. 691 00:34:32,100 --> 00:34:35,100 Just come straight and if he didn't have weight, it wouldn't make an awful lot of difference. 692 00:34:35,100 --> 00:34:37,100 That's right. 693 00:34:37,100 --> 00:34:40,100 And the ascent you feel took about the same. 694 00:34:40,100 --> 00:34:42,100 Same. 695 00:34:42,100 --> 00:34:44,100 He didn't go back. 696 00:34:44,100 --> 00:34:46,100 He didn't deviate at all. He didn't flip back and more. 697 00:34:46,100 --> 00:34:50,100 It's like I say, he said, come down straight. 698 00:34:50,100 --> 00:34:52,100 Straight back. 699 00:34:52,100 --> 00:34:56,100 Did you see any change of expression on this face when he turns and looked at you? 700 00:34:56,100 --> 00:35:02,100 Could you see any indication of smile or or anything? 701 00:35:02,100 --> 00:35:04,100 No indication of expression. 702 00:35:04,100 --> 00:35:07,100 You didn't feel that you feel that you were looking at a pair of eyes? 703 00:35:07,100 --> 00:35:08,100 Yeah. 704 00:35:08,100 --> 00:35:10,100 Were the eyes sober? 705 00:35:10,100 --> 00:35:12,100 And did I ask you this before? 706 00:35:12,100 --> 00:35:14,100 But I'm going to ask you one more time. 707 00:35:14,100 --> 00:35:16,100 We looked at you. Did you feel like you were being looked at? 708 00:35:16,100 --> 00:35:18,100 Yeah. 709 00:35:18,100 --> 00:35:23,100 I mean, if I put a doll out there and it had eyes that were pointed right towards you, okay? 710 00:35:23,100 --> 00:35:25,100 And you were looking right at the doll's eyes. 711 00:35:25,100 --> 00:35:30,100 Wouldn't there be a difference between that and looking at another living being? 712 00:35:30,100 --> 00:35:36,100 Uh, I would have liked, I know what you were getting at and to think about it. 713 00:35:36,100 --> 00:35:49,100 But at that time, you know, I felt that I was looking at something that was more alive than a robot, you know, because of the movement, you know. 714 00:35:49,100 --> 00:35:55,100 When I look at you right now, and I'm not, this is ten feet here, a good ten feet, all right? 715 00:35:55,100 --> 00:35:59,100 And you say this is about the distance. When I look at you, there is something going on between you and I. 716 00:35:59,100 --> 00:36:02,100 There is a communication between us now. 717 00:36:02,100 --> 00:36:05,100 Did you feel this kind of communication between you and that thing? 718 00:36:05,100 --> 00:36:09,100 I put, like, you know, observation, you know. 719 00:36:09,100 --> 00:36:12,100 Just observation? Well, that's what I meant. I didn't mean that. 720 00:36:12,100 --> 00:36:13,100 Yeah. 721 00:36:13,100 --> 00:36:15,100 Actually, a real communication of any kind. 722 00:36:15,100 --> 00:36:18,100 I'm not a person that you were sizing me up and I was sizing you up. 723 00:36:18,100 --> 00:36:19,100 Observation. 724 00:36:19,100 --> 00:36:21,100 And you got this kind of a feeling. 725 00:36:21,100 --> 00:36:29,100 Would you, in the next few days, if you do have any dream repetitions, would you carefully document them? 726 00:36:29,100 --> 00:36:34,100 Put down what you, so that your memory is perfected by writing. 727 00:36:34,100 --> 00:36:42,100 Put down what you, when you have a repeat dream or something like that, and tell me whether it's distorted or whether it's accurate. 728 00:36:42,100 --> 00:36:44,100 Oh, I tell you, I don't jump about it twice. 729 00:36:44,100 --> 00:36:47,100 And it is still not distorted. 730 00:36:47,100 --> 00:36:48,100 Just plain recall. 731 00:36:48,100 --> 00:36:49,100 Same recall. 732 00:36:49,100 --> 00:37:03,100 Yeah, well, of course, I may be leaping over the bounds of investigative ethics here, but you see, there is some precedent set for repeated dream patterns. 733 00:37:03,100 --> 00:37:05,100 After such an experience. 734 00:37:05,100 --> 00:37:09,100 And this is the reason I ask you to document it. 735 00:37:09,100 --> 00:37:11,100 Actually, one question. 736 00:37:11,100 --> 00:37:12,100 Yeah. 737 00:37:12,100 --> 00:37:19,100 Now you're talking to a tape and just here is a form of the week. 738 00:37:19,100 --> 00:37:24,100 Sort of like you had to fill out a lot of it is all it is just circling circling areas. 739 00:37:24,100 --> 00:37:26,100 In other words, it's choosing right here. 740 00:37:26,100 --> 00:37:29,100 There's a place where you can tell your own story. 741 00:37:29,100 --> 00:37:30,100 You use a typewriter. 742 00:37:30,100 --> 00:37:31,100 Of course, it takes up less space. 743 00:37:31,100 --> 00:37:35,100 Or you want to add a piece of paper fine to tell your own story. 744 00:37:35,100 --> 00:37:38,100 And then, of course, expecting a signature. 745 00:37:38,100 --> 00:37:40,100 Now, why is that signature there? 746 00:37:40,100 --> 00:37:42,100 Because that's sort of math and David. 747 00:37:42,100 --> 00:37:47,100 In other words, what you're telling us is the absolute truth and you're willing to sign. 748 00:37:47,100 --> 00:37:48,100 Okay. 749 00:37:48,100 --> 00:37:53,100 I'm doing it for the tape right here and I'm hoping that I don't have to stay around here and get this thing filled out. 750 00:37:53,100 --> 00:37:54,100 You can do it on your own. 751 00:37:54,100 --> 00:37:57,100 And I hope your good will send us to us. 752 00:37:57,100 --> 00:38:02,100 I don't I forgot to bring you a stamp envelope, which I probably should have. 753 00:38:02,100 --> 00:38:04,100 But you'll send it into us. 754 00:38:04,100 --> 00:38:07,100 Maybe we can send you something back. 755 00:38:07,100 --> 00:38:08,100 He's back. 756 00:38:08,100 --> 00:38:10,100 Well, I'll put it in another way. 757 00:38:10,100 --> 00:38:21,100 I'm so anxious to go with you to the spot to read out from there that if you will set a period for me to pick you up and take you out there, then you can have this ready for me when I do. 758 00:38:21,100 --> 00:38:23,100 Saturday is going to be a good day. 759 00:38:23,100 --> 00:38:26,100 What in the daytime because that's the time to go. 760 00:38:26,100 --> 00:38:30,100 Otherwise you won't be able to see that what I'm asking is for the tape now. 761 00:38:30,100 --> 00:38:37,100 Can we use this tape strictly for research purposes and things that we have to do with it in the UFO world? 762 00:38:37,100 --> 00:38:39,100 Yeah, you don't mind. 763 00:38:39,100 --> 00:38:41,100 Okay. Number two. 764 00:38:41,100 --> 00:38:45,100 This is the absolute as far as you know truth. 765 00:38:45,100 --> 00:38:46,100 Right. 766 00:38:46,100 --> 00:38:48,100 And you're telling it as it was. 767 00:38:48,100 --> 00:38:50,100 For the tape. 768 00:38:50,100 --> 00:38:55,100 We're going to leave this with you and by Saturday I hope that you look at it. 769 00:38:55,100 --> 00:38:57,100 I know I hate to tell things about it. 770 00:38:57,100 --> 00:39:02,100 Yes, as much as you do, if not more, he told me on the radio on the telephone that there was no interference. 771 00:39:02,100 --> 00:39:04,100 Did you have a radio on at the time? 772 00:39:04,100 --> 00:39:05,100 No. Okay. 773 00:39:05,100 --> 00:39:09,100 So that we don't have no light failure of any kind, no motor failure of any kind. 774 00:39:09,100 --> 00:39:12,100 He told me that on the phone that there wasn't any failure at all. 775 00:39:12,100 --> 00:39:13,100 Okay. 776 00:39:13,100 --> 00:39:14,100 So I won't worry about that. 777 00:39:14,100 --> 00:39:19,100 So you get this thing filled out and the flurry comes by or I'll come by within the Saturday. 778 00:39:19,100 --> 00:39:23,100 And we'll go up to the spot and take a look and see what is around there. 779 00:39:23,100 --> 00:39:30,100 Why you think that one spot, whether it's an isolated area, whether it's a curb or whether it's next to an underpass or something like that. 780 00:39:30,100 --> 00:39:32,100 Why it is pretty close to an underpass. 781 00:39:32,100 --> 00:39:33,100 That's what you said. 782 00:39:33,100 --> 00:39:37,100 Yeah, that's why I said it because I wouldn't have known otherwise. 783 00:39:37,100 --> 00:39:38,100 Okay. 784 00:39:38,100 --> 00:39:39,100 That's all I wanted to know. 785 00:39:39,100 --> 00:39:41,100 I think I don't have any other questions. 786 00:39:41,100 --> 00:39:48,100 No, when you hit an account like this, your account is the only place we can go, you know, like you say, we have no other witness across the world. 787 00:39:48,100 --> 00:39:51,100 I know the witness across examined, you know, nothing. 788 00:39:51,100 --> 00:40:00,100 All we have is you know, the only thing which would be of interest if your friend Mr. Goodman would like to relate to us. 789 00:40:00,100 --> 00:40:04,100 His recall of your experience when it happened. 790 00:40:04,100 --> 00:40:06,100 I'd appreciate that.